Monday, September 04, 2006

Lord of the Flies ch.1

Since we are running out of time in class to discuss Lord Of the Flies, I stole an idea from Moritz's class where they are discussing the novel online. So in the spirit of creating great discussion amongst my two classes, I want you to discuss with one another what you think of LOF so far? What are your initial impressions? What questions do you have? Can you help to answer one another's questions? Talk to me people!


Blogger Phillips said...

My only question so far is where were they flying to that they could crash on a tropical Island with a coral reef? I find it intersting that they are all so young, yet the already have some idea of how to live on there own and how to help ships find them. Also, I find it interesting that they are all young enough that they don't know how to run a fair society and they will start to want power over the other kids.

Tue Sep 05, 09:28:00 AM  
Blogger KathrynT said...

My first impresion of Lord of the Flies was that the book is odd and confusing. I had many questions as to where is this happening and how did they get there? It sounds like they are in the Pacific Ocean poosibly during WW1. I noticed that it said something about a storm and an atom bomb. What might that mean?

Tue Sep 05, 09:29:00 AM  
Blogger sarahc said...

I think that the notion kathrynt had about it being during WW1 is very likely. If it ws during the war, the children might have been evacuated by plane. I think that if it was a war time, the children would have been taught how to survive. This theory is also supported by the fact that the children are taking action so quickly and are adapting to the island. During a war, everyone learns to survive anyway they can.

My first impression of Piggy is that he has faced lots of hardship. I mean, we know his dad has died and he lives with his aunt. That makes me wonder what happened to his mom. I wonder if she is in trouble with the law. Maybe she killed her husband. The fact that Piggy is reluctant to talk about her makes me lean towards thinking that she is in jail.

Tue Sep 05, 09:51:00 AM  
Blogger christa s said...

My first impression of the book is that it is really symbolic, partly because all of the books we read in English have a lot of symbolism in them, and partly because there are a lot of hints as to what will happen in the future. For example, already two leaders have emerged in the group of boys-Ralph and Jack. But Jack, for some reason just seems to show a dark side. It makes me wonder what will happen to Ralph.
I don't really have any questions so far, but one thing that I think is interesting is that the boys don't even really seem homesick. They just kind of automatically make their own little society and don't really make very much reference to their past, apart from Piggy, who is always talking about his aunt.

Tue Sep 05, 11:41:00 AM  
Blogger erinl said...

When I first started reading LOF, I was really confused. Anyone else get the same feeling. I also don't understand what the children are talking about with this scar thing? Help me out here becuase I am a little confused...

Tue Sep 05, 12:43:00 PM  
Blogger Madisonm said...

One thing that I have begun to notice, when reading the first chapter of LOTF, was that Piggy comes off sort of like a hypochondriac. It seems like he has been avoiding many activities and sittuations because of his asthma. He also may have been overly sheltered from everything from his Aunt. He just seems like a very paranoid person, and he seems to be anchored down by his "illness".

I also wonder why he told Ralph that his name was Piggy, if he didnt want to be called that. He kind of set himself up for that...

Tue Sep 05, 12:47:00 PM  
Blogger sarahc said...

Hey erinl! I think the scar they refer to it the place where the cabin of the plane landed when it crashed.

Tue Sep 05, 01:22:00 PM  
Blogger AnnaD said...

It is very annoying to have your comment deleted by blogger, so I will try to rewrite this comment to a semblance of what it was before. Since I have already read this book, I have been trying to look at in a different way in this class. Frankly, I can't. I was not fond of the book then, and I am not fond of the book now. I feel that the book is a grim and depressing story of innocent boys turning into murderous, bloodthirsty savages, and I despise the idea. The book delves into the primeval instincts of mankind that create this dark, sickening web of events in the book. I would prefer not to have to think about these things. Please don't get me wrong, it's not that I don't want to hear and understand the realities of life, it's just that this is not life. This is a horror story. I will keep trying to see this book in a different way, but I wouldn't be surprised if I come out of the experience hating it as much as I did the first time.

Tue Sep 05, 01:40:00 PM  
Blogger ADRIANA G said...

I like what Christa S said about Jack's dark side. I think that Ralph too may have a dark side. My first impression of Ralph was that he was a very self-centered boy. He did come close to showing signs of compassion when Piggy tried to follow the exploration party. Ralph considered apologizing but then decided that he had to be a leader and the best way to do that was to agree with everyone else in the belief that they were better than Piggy. I think he doesn't entirely know what he is doing. Some children don't understand the damage they can do. Fortunately, there are usually adults to help keep them in check. I wonder what will happen when the boys are allowed to do mostly what they want without adults to guard them from the possible consequences.

Tue Sep 05, 01:44:00 PM  
Blogger EmilyL said...

Even though we are only in chpater one, I feel that the main characters are already hinting as to their backgrounds. Jack seems to act like he has been hurt in the past. He acts tough, but underneath the skin he is hurting. I personally think that Ralph comes from the same mold as Jack no matter how little he wants to admit it. As for Piggy I agree with MadisonM that he has lived his whole life shletered and has not reaaly been exposed to the world.

Tue Sep 05, 01:45:00 PM  
Blogger Lane C. said...

I like what Madison M.said about Piggy being a hypochondriac. I definitely picked that up as well. I also noticed that he can sometimes be very optomistic but at other times be the most pessemistic person around. He continually hopes that there still might be grown ups around, but then when Ralph is talking about his dad, he totally changes and has no hope at all that will be rescued. My biggest question right now is what time period is this. There is talk of an explosion at the airport and the plane sounds like it was pretty high tech. Is this set in the future from when it was written or the past or present?

Tue Sep 05, 01:57:00 PM  
Blogger kjerstinl said...

I agree with annad about reading this book and it being a horrible book and so wretched and just everything that happens in it is just revolting. I too read this book (obviously) a couple years ago and it was not one of my favorites. But, I think that I will try and look at the book in a different way and make different connections and delve a little deeper. I read this book three years ago, so I don't remember eveything, but rereading this is bringing back all of the memories.
I agree with Phillip in wondering how the boys got to the isnland in the first place. Where were they going? Where were they coming from? What brought them all together? Why were there only boys? Why not girls? What happened to the adults? Why were there so many kids on the plane? What hit the plane? What bomb? How did the boys get to the ground without getting hurt, was it a contraption of some sort or something? What kind of war is going on for someone to use a bomb? What island are the boys on? How will people find out where the boys are? How is Ralph's dad supposed to come and rescue them all? Some many questions rushing into my head at once, it's overwhelming! Maybe with the answers, we can make connections??? Who knows!
Well, when christa s said that she thought that Jack has a "dark side", I'm not sure if I entirely agree with that. I think that Jack does have a mean personality, but I think that it's just how he was raised. Plus, we can see this from him. He's easier to read. Unlike Jack, Ralph is the one who I think has the "dark side". Ralph is so mysterious, we know nothing about him, and all of a sudden, he has taken power, knows exactly what to do, and is the leader of the island. So how come out of no where this can happen? Also, Ralph just gives me the creeps. He's so mean, and bossy, rude, obnoxious. It makes me angry. But it makes me think that he's hiding something from everyone. Not only that, I think he's selfish. I believe that the only reason that he "cares" about others is so that he can take care of himself and make sure that his dad comes to get him. I believe that the only reason for his course of actions isn't really for the good of the group.
But this leads me to another question, how can all these young boys agree with this little order? How do they let Ralph be the one to control everything? How come the whole process of choosing was so simple? I have more questions, but for now I have forgotten them...
Another person who makes me wonder is Simon. Although his part is not huge, it just makes you wonder why he's being mentioned in the book. It seems as if there's going to be a bigger part with Simon and that he's an important character and that the story with subtly develop around him. I don't know if that's just from my knowledge from the book or just me imagining things, but Simon is different from all the others.

Tue Sep 05, 03:12:00 PM  
Blogger EmilyA said...

I first thought that LOF was really confusing and that it did not make much sense. I didnt know why there were not any adults and why they were on some random island. I did not want to continue reading it but as I got into it it made more and more sense. I found out that a plane crashed onto the island stranding many children on it. Later all of the kids meet on a beach and discuss how they are going to survive. A boy brings up seeing a creature in the woods and i have been questioning what that creature is and if the boy is telling the truth. I also wonder why and how the plane crashed onto this island. I have many qeustions but hopefully as I continue to read I will figure them out

Tue Sep 05, 03:38:00 PM  
Blogger Sarah C said...

I got many first impressions of the characters in this book. My first impression of Piggy was that he was old beyond his years. He was the only child who acted like more of a adult that even Ralph. Would he have been a good choice for leader? I also got the feeling that he was geekish, and an easy bullying target. My fisrt impression of Ralph was that he was the type of boy anyone would like. The type of boy who people looked up to, who would become the football playing, cute, and smart type boy. Although he is not smarter than Piggy, i can see why he was chosen as the Chief. I had a very scary first impression of Jack. He reminds me of the bad guy. His temper and tryannical behavior gave me a "he's gonna do something horrible" impression. Did anyone else get that creepy-crawly impression from him?
My first impression of the book itself was a good one. I know most people say the don't enjoy the books inside in class (for any PMS students, an example would be Johnny Tremain), but i actually like this book a lot so far. It is very intriguig.
I have TONS of question so far. Such as What happened to the boys to strand them on an island? Where were they headed and why? What happened to the boy that was never found after the fire? and What is the "bestie" the keeps coming up, haunting dreams? If anyone has any thoughts, please share! :)
The character that really scares me is Jack. I won't get into much detail, just in case some of you haven't gotten to what I'm talking about, but he is changing personalities so fast. He has become a bloodthirsty killing machine! All he wants now is to kill something, but does he care what (or who?) he kills? "We want meat" he says, but is he willing to go past moral boundaries to get some (yuck!). I also notice that as Jack and Ralph change, they become more distant and less of friends.Could Jack be, or become the beastie?!
The thing that i thought was fascinating about this book is that the boys are making their own little world. They have the hunters, or food providers, a leader, and different social groups that are starting to develop (the littluns' and the bigguns'). With age dividing the boys, will it be their downfall? If so, is it relating to what might happen in our futures? Will racism, separations of people by race, gender etc., and cliques be OUR downfall as well?

Tue Sep 05, 03:45:00 PM  
Blogger chelseah said...

I agree with erinl with what she said about LOF being really confusing. When I first started reading it, I was very confused by the phrases and sayings that they used. Also, I was very confused on what the 'scar' was.
I was also confused, because I felt that Golding didn't explain things well enough. I agree with kjerstinl with her questions. Such as, what island are they on? Also, I was perplexed about where the boys were going in the first place, and where they were coming from?
Overall, I like the story line of LOF, and I think that it will have a good message about survival and friendship, even though I am only at chapter 2.
I don't know if I agree that Jack has a dark side. I believe that he may have this pent up jealousy and/or something causing him to want "revenge". But again, I do think that everyone has some hidden secret about someone else, or something. I do believe that the variety of personalities on the island will cause some rivalries and enemies. But, this does make the story a lot more interesting to read.
I think that Piggy has a good heart, and that overtime the rest of the boys will begin to like him and become friends with him. I think that the boys judge him by his look and don't give him a chance.

Tue Sep 05, 03:48:00 PM  
Blogger paigen said...

I think the book so far is a lot like Hatchet. But I am also wondering what an all boys school is doing flying over a non-charted island? What kind of field trip is this? I also don't like how they don't tell you how many days they have been on the island. But over all I like it and I think it is a very interesting book.

Tue Sep 05, 03:53:00 PM  
Blogger BenH said...

On the issue of whether it takes place in WWI or not, I am quite sure it does not. The back of my book says "At the dawn of the next World War..." The book was written in 1954, so I think this means WWIII. Also, if it were WWI, there would not be an atom bomb.

Tue Sep 05, 03:59:00 PM  
Blogger BenH said...

I think all the stuff that has been said about people having a dark side is very interesting. What I think is also interesting is what are the ramifications of each person having a darkside that surfaces.

Ralph: I think if Ralph's darkside surfaces, he could be very dangerous because he is in command, and a lot of the other children have come to follow him without a lot of hesitation. Also, he did a good job of working them into a frenzy when he decided fire was needed, so we could very well have them follow him in his dark footsteps. And the incident of the beastie show that he can sometimes be mildly unstable. I think the combination of these factors, as well as all the things we do not know about him could be very dangerous.

Jack: If Jack's darkside surfaces, it could also be dangerous. After chapter one, he begins to have a little bit of conflict with Ralph over his hunting parties. I think the Jack's hesitation to slay the hog brought out many of his insecurities. People with insecurities are often dangerous because they want to prove themselves, and may go to great lengths to do so. Also, he has what seems to be a loyal following among the choir boys. I think they would follow Jack above Ralph. But I am not really sure.

Everyone has a dark side though. What matters is whose will surface, and what will happen when it does. I think the opposing personalities of Jack and Ralph may create conflict later on.

As far as piggy goes, I doubt in a story like this he will finally be accepted. I think he will be singled out for his differences and obvious insecurites. They view him as weak, and very well might use him as a scapegoat. And if that happens, I think he may even be killed in rage. He seems to be the one person most at odds with the group dynamic.

Tue Sep 05, 04:13:00 PM  
Blogger tomr said...

One impression I got is that the line between good and bad is very distinct. Right off the bat, Piggy is established as a wimp, what with his constant complaining and getting bullied, which is clearly supposed to evoke sympathy from us. Jack, on the other hand, is dark and brooding. This is quite a cliché, and I feel it makes the story a bit boring. (This is, of course, in conjunction with Golding's mediocre, at best, writing style.)

Although I too have read this before, I am trying to read with an open mind.

I believe he used children as characters so he could display a more primitive, natural side to human nature (as children are usually seen to be more innocent and pure, and thus less manipulated by society). Essentially, his goal is to show a society that has been formed under dire circumstances can never really function properly. The children also add an ironic twist to the savagery of the whole novel.

Tue Sep 05, 04:55:00 PM  
Blogger elyse h said...

I agree that LOF starts out pretty confusing, it took a while for me to understand the storyline and where it is going. I agree with paige n, this book reminds me alot of hatchet, boys crashing in an uncharted and uncivilized place. Kjersten l brought up a lot of questions i hadn't thought about yet, and now i really do wonder where the boys were going, where the boys were coming from, and why it's just boys. The whole thing seems like it was somewhat planned out to me. I agree that Ralph has a dark side that i think might show through later on in the story, he is just so self centered that he doesn't even bother to find out what piggy's real name is. It does seem that Piggy was very sheltered while he lived with his aunt so he seems like he doesn't have the greatest social skills. I don't think that will go over all too well later on in the story either. Over all i don't really care for the book too much. The story line seems sort of random to me and like it doesn't have much point to it, at least so far. I'm sure it will get more interesting but right now it's just kind of boring.

Tue Sep 05, 05:12:00 PM  
Blogger adamb said...

I believe that this book is a sort of example or theroy of what would happen if people or especially kids are left alone with no authority. There are people who follow and a few who leadthe others. And obviously conflict. In the book, you see hat Ralph is a kind and fair person and he commands respect for that and his initiative to take charge while on the other hand, Jack is shown as a cruel, hard person who gains his authority from intimidation and fear. You can see this when P iggy tries to talk. When Piggy speaks out against Jack's idea, Jack violenty rebukes him without even letting Piggy finish a sentence. But Ralph steps in and protects Piggy's right to speak. This is also a point in the story when Jack and Ralph start to conflict in intrest. And I think that this tension will grow into a dispute and the kids will split into two groups. One group with Ralph that wants to stay civilized and peaceful and one group that follows Jack and degenerates into a barbarian society where the strong rule. Aother reason I think this will happen is that William Gooding, wrote this book in simple terms. It is apparent from when all the chaacters are introduced that there are archetypes involved. Ralph is main character and the classic hero who rises above all to lead. And piggy is his, talkative, annoying, kind of weak sidekick who helps him through his struggles. And Jack and his quire of hunters are the evil within that will strike against the hero at the most oppurtune moment. But the book is still well written and interesting and I can't wait to finish it.

Tue Sep 05, 05:25:00 PM  
Blogger Mphair said...

So far LOF has potential. I noramally don't like books assigned in school mainly because I like having the freedom to choose my own. However, LOF is a school assigned book...

Anyway, I think that it will be a worthwile book to read, much like The Giver by Lois Lowery. It my not be my favorite book of all time, but I believe that it will leave its mark.

The author addresses some interesting topics and he presents them in a way that I normally wouldn't think of. For instance, I think that LOF is going to be a story of life in general. For example, when Rlaph, Jack, and Simon go exploring, and they are somewhat lost, reminds me of life. Stumbling along the road of life, lost, confused, and seemingly eaten alive. Then something posotive happens in your life, and suddenly you can see, the whole world seems to brighten. Another way that this reminds me of real people, is when they vote on leaders, the chior was so used to Jack being their leader that it seemed that they couldn't imagine anyone else being their leader, or that it didn't really occur to them that they had a choice. Isn't that what some people do? Don't they just go with what they are used to, even if that know deep down that they are wrong??

Tue Sep 05, 05:30:00 PM  
Blogger Mphair said...

By the way I totally agree with Madison M. Piggy completely opened the door to his own humilliation by telling Ralph what he didn't want to be called...

Then again, when Ralph told the group that the name was Piggy, he had been somewhat defending Piggy from the name of Fatty...

Tue Sep 05, 05:35:00 PM  
Blogger McKennad said...

There is already a lot of symbolism in LOF. Like Piggy's glasses, he always cleans them when he can't portray his emotions of humiliation, sadness, or loss for words. The conch signifies how rules can easily be changed when authority wants more power. Piggy is definately the brains of the opporation, and Ralph is the beauty, everyone is drawn to him because of his good looks, and because of the air of authority about him. This book shows true human nature, like how people make fun of Piggy even if they tell him not to. I wander how things are going to turn out, and when will the reality finally set in.

Tue Sep 05, 05:40:00 PM  
Blogger Rileys said...

I think that it's very interesting how fast a civilization can fall to barbarism if there is no respected leading power to govern the society. Many of the boys seem to be leading to play more than they want to work and make their lives better and if another leader speaks up and says he will create a fun and exciting tribe with lots of food with little work than most of the boys will flock to that leader and abandon the others to the better more civilized way of living with order and descent lives.
i would delve into this more but i have little time for jazz starts in -10 minutes so maybe i'll talk more later about the sublject.

Tue Sep 05, 05:56:00 PM  
Blogger tanal said...

Along with Chelsea and Erin I was also very confused when i started reading this book. They use many cofusing phrases and sayings that don't make much sense. I didn't know what they meant by the scar either, but now after reading a little more i think it is the path the airplane left when it crashed onto the island. Maybe it tore and destroyed all of the trees, plants, and surrounding things.

It seems to me that LOF could be compared or related to many lives here at AHS even. There is always that one person who has the power over everyone and thinks that they know everything and that they can do anything that they want, even though he really never knows what he is talking about. On the other hand Piggy knows a lot of information that Ralph does not, but when he trys to share that info or inform the others nobody listens to him because of his apearance and Ralph doesn't want anyone to take over his power.

Tue Sep 05, 06:04:00 PM  
Blogger shaunam said...

When Piggy told Ralph what he didn't want to be called, Piggy most definately brought it on himself to be teased. Piggy should have known that you cannot TRUST somebody within a few minutes; it takes time to build trust. So far, I think that this is my most favorite book that i have read so far in all of school. I really do like the book because I can completely picture what the island looks like in my mind. Also I think that Piggy's specs represent humiliation and embarassment since he always takes them off and plays with them when he feels that way.
I also agree about the sybolsim about the conch that mckennad said.

Tue Sep 05, 06:34:00 PM  
Blogger Shelby B. said...

At first I ws very confused about what was going on, that's when I realized that there were two people, so then I had to go back and read it again. Then I started to get confused again so I had to go back and start over. I realized that it can take a few times to understand concepts in the book. So it is worth it not to wait untill the last minute and to spend some time on the book.

I started to realize a few things in this book, one of them was that it was a little like "The Cay". Also, I started to question, like why do some of the children think they are better than others? Along with Chelsea H. I was confused about what the 'scar' was, but overall the book is better than I thought and heard it was going to be.

Tue Sep 05, 06:44:00 PM  
Blogger AleeA said...

Wow, so much has happened so far in this book and all at the same time! I have found that I personally am enjoying this book so far, for it has adventure and conflict which pulls me right in as a reader. I have found the amount of information that happens in each chapter to be a bit of a drag, for it is hard to remember everything that happens, but so far overall, I think it is a pretty good book!
My initial impressions are pretty simple, when I first looked at the book, I wasn't that interested. I didn't think that a bunch of school boys getting stranded on an island would be that much fun to read, but as I started reading, I found that this wasn't really the case. Now my impressions for the book are pretty good, for it contains some real life conflicts and situations that we can all relate to. Some of these include getting along with people whether we want to or not, and using our resources to the best of our abilities.
Due to the quick pace of the book, there are a few things that have kind of left me hanging. For example, what caused the plane that the boys were on to crash?! It said something about a storm in the book, but it never clarified that this is what caused the plane to crash. Also, I really want to know why Piggy doesn't talk about his mom or how his dad died. What is the story behind him living with his aunt? Why do some of the boys like Piggy at certain times, then push him away later? This all just doesn't make sense to me!
For those who asked what a scar is, it is by definition a "precipitous, rocky place; cliff." It is also (by definition), "a low or submerged rock in the sea." This tells me that the scar on the island in the book is a rocky place/cliff that surrounds, or partially surrounds, the lagoon. To answer the questions about the atom bomb, I imagine that it has something to do with the war that is going on during the book. Maybe the boys were on the plane to escape the threat of the atom bomb, or something to that extent. That would be my best guess about the bomb based on the little that we know about it and its role in the story so far.

Tue Sep 05, 06:49:00 PM  
Blogger joshb said...

This book is certainly unique. I have talked to a lot of people who have read the book and they either liked it or disliked it with a fiery passion. I myself did not enjoy the book; however I felt that it was an accurate portrayal of what would actually happen if a bunch of boys got stranded on an island. This book really brings out the desperate situations and actions that the boys are involved in. It highlights the savagery that one may be drawn towards when faced with such desperate situations. Good and evil are brought out in this book. Jack and the choir signify the untamed animal inside everyone that jumps out when least expected. Ralph and the others signify fortitude and steadfastness in the face of perilous and unsure times. I would say that this book is and allegory of an event that actually took place. As of the identity if that event I am not sure, but I'm sure that someone could find one.

Tue Sep 05, 07:24:00 PM  
Blogger jess b said...

I really like Lord of the Flies so far. I think that its fairly intresting and there are many things taht I can relate too. My family is big on outdoorsy stuff and we've gotten ourselves stranded up in the mountains a few times ourselves. For me, I have personal experiences on survival; but, its always intresting to see what types of roles people take in working to get back to normal civilization.
When I first looked at the book I was excited to read it. I'm not very girly girl so I love these type of books. Lord of the Flies is a book that I have heard alot about and many people seem to like it. The first couple of pages were kind of boring though. I love books that really grab your attention and to me, this one didn't really.
Some questions that I had when reading were:
What is the significance of the shell. It seems to hold a certain power; the boys respect it. Anyone with the shell has everyone else's full attention. I found it intresting that a sense of "laws" have already started to be established.
Also, I didn't understand how all the boys were connected. I know that they were on a plane that was crashed; but, how many kids were on the plane? Were they all from the same school? No one knew each others names, so, I don't know.
To answer alee's question about why sometimes people listen to Piggy and why sometimes they don't is basically because he's an outsider. He's the normal "geek" I guess you could say. He's not popular, skinny, attractive, or a leader. He doesn't have ownership and wears glasses. It's hard for kids this age, our age, to include everyone. Many people like to pick on others and the ones who stick out the most are the main target.

Tue Sep 05, 07:27:00 PM  
Blogger erinl said...

Like I said earlier, I was really confused when I first started reading this book. I literally re-read the first ten pages five times before I understood what was going on. I'm glad that I wasn't the only one. Once I started understanding what was going on, I got into the book and was pretty excited about reading it. Honestly when I first started reading I wasn't intrested, not that I really like it now, but it's growing on me. I agree with shelbyb, it sounds almost like The Cay, which was a book that I read in 6th grade. I see alot of similarities, so I can really connect to each of the texts.
I have to say that I am suspicious of Jack and his actions, I think that he really wants to be leader and really thinks that he should be in charge instead of Ralph. He yells alot at Piggy, which is really sad becuase he is just trying to help everyone. Although, I think that Ralph is doing a pretty good job at being a leader to all these kids on the island, but I was disapointed when Ralph announced that his name was Piggy to everyone. I think that Piggy (does he have another name?) should be a co-leader or at least be helping Ralph with his decisions.
I think that the children will end up living on this island for a while. No one would know where the plane was shot down, and if this story takes place durring WWII there are alot of things going on.
Do we know how many kids are on this island? How will the story play out if there are so many kids on the island and hardly any work being done?

Tue Sep 05, 07:29:00 PM  
Blogger erinl said...

By the way, anyone know how the title might relate to the book?

Tue Sep 05, 07:30:00 PM  
Blogger hannahs said...

I think that Lord of the Flies is quite an interesting book so far. I cannot imagine boys, some of whom are six years old, being stranded on an island. It is amazing that they are able to survive. I mean yes, they are humans and they know what they need to survive but these are children. I am older than all of the characters and I can't even begin to think what I would do to survive on an island. Also, I think the book is a giant metaphor in some ways. Piggy represents logic and reason because while Ralph is having a good time exploring the island, Piggy is trying to come up with plans for the future. He looks ahead and plans for what is to come rather than on "the moment". I think this is a very mature quality. Jack, on the other hand, represents opression and control because he thinks his way is the only way. On the first page it says "...a bird, a vision of red and yellow, flashed upwards with a witch-like cry..." My question is does the bird symbolize what it to come? I ask this because sometimes red symbolizes evil and in genersal, that is what the boys have to deal with. I disagree with Jessica B. I think Piggy is rarely listened to because he represents reason. A bunch of young boys stranded on an island probably do not want to hear what the right thing to do is. Often in real life, people stray from the right "path".

Tue Sep 05, 07:54:00 PM  
Blogger Aylar said...

OK this is a test BLOGGER is being difficult tonight this is the 5th time I've tried to do this!!!!

Tue Sep 05, 08:06:00 PM  
Blogger Aylar said...

OK now it's working...... Hopefully....
I enjoyed the opening of Lord of the Flies. It seems like a great survival story. Full of adventure and exicitment. The author has already captivated my attenion with this book and I'm definitly excited to read more.

Tue Sep 05, 08:09:00 PM  
Blogger TyC said...

Lord of the Flies is pretty good through chapter one, but it is also left me a little but confused. First of all, I don't see why a plane full of boys and one pilot are flying out over the ocean. Secondly, I don't see how all the boys survived the plane crash but the pilot died. The last question that I have is where the plane was headed before it crashed on the island.

Tue Sep 05, 08:11:00 PM  
Blogger karib said...

From my first impressions of chapter, I think most of the kids, especially Ralph are very immature. They seem to laugh hysterically about the dumbest things, and they treat their situation more like a game than a fight for survival. If I were in a plane crash on a deserted island in the middle of nowhere, I probably wouldn't be passing around a conch telling people when they can and can't speak. I don't think they realize the big picture of the fact that they're in a bad prediciment to be in. I'm not really sure I'm a big fan of this book so far, I understand what's going on, the characters just get on my nerves. I'm also not sure Ralph is the best leader for the group, which it seems like he has become. It surprised me that some of the older boys didn't take charge, and they left their very survival in the hands of Ralph. Also, why are there no girls. Responding to kathrynt's and sarahc's comment about the atom bomb, wouldn't the atom bomb be in WWII, not WWI? I also find the descripitons of the settings difficult to visualize. I don't know if that is due to the vocab or what.

Tue Sep 05, 08:17:00 PM  
Blogger Zachf said...

Lord of The Flies is a book I enjoyed from the start. I wondered why there was nothing explaining how these kids got stuck on an island to start the book. I guess it's a nice way to jump into things. A few questions I had were why does Piggy keep repeating "no grownups" and why doesn't Ralph ask Piggy his real name?

Tue Sep 05, 08:28:00 PM  
Blogger kimmy c said...

Like most everyone has said this book is sort of confusing. As I read the first chapter, some of the words Golding used to describe different colors, and land formations really cofused me. I could not and still have noot figured out what the "creepers" were. I think that this book is taking an interesting turn. First off I feel that this book will not have a happy ending. The way the two boys, Ralph and Jack are make me think that they will probably eventually make up two different groups. Also, I really don't agree with the "dark side" theory, I don't really see that in either of the two boys. I do see that through either boys leadership, corruption might and probably will be happening. Finally, I see Piggy as the most mature and reasonable character on the island. Yea, I do see where he's sort of an overprotective type of guy, but I really think that playing it safe is the way to go. I think that Piggy would have made the best and most reasonable choice for a leader.

Tue Sep 05, 09:03:00 PM  
Blogger BenH said...

Hopefully this will be a little more concise. I think that hannas brought up a good point in the symbolism of a bird. I would also like to know if that symbolizes something or if it is just colorful imagery.

I forgot to mention this before, but i think it was originally madisonm (correct me if im wrong) who said that Piggy was sheltered, and I think that that is a good assesment.

I think tomr brought up an excellent point about the use of children. I think that is a very good guess as to Goldings choice of children. However, I disagree in the sense that the line between good and evil is very distinct. I think what characters are supposed to be, such as whiny piggy and dark jack is very defined. And I don't like shallow characters when the shallowness reveals nothing interesting underneath, or characters like Piggy which are intented to evoke sympathy.

Tue Sep 05, 09:12:00 PM  
Blogger saram said...

I TOTALLY agree with chelseah. LOTF has been very confusing so far. Golding doesn't explain anything and he also moves very fast. I don't know if this is just for the beginning and he'll slow down once we get further into the book, but for now, it's very hard to follow.
I also agree with paigen. When I first started reading this book, I was immediatley reminded of Hatchet. However, so far I enjoyed Hatchet more than I am enjoying LOTF.
I wonder what a plane is doing flying an entire school of boys over an uncharted island. Are they taking a field trip? Where are they going? And the book said that the plane was shot down. What shot them down? And since they were shot down over an uncharted island, does that mean there are people on the island?

Tue Sep 05, 09:20:00 PM  
Blogger briang said...

I have really enjoyed LOF so far. I have actually liked it so much that I have been reading ahead, and just so all you people who have all those questions know, alot of answers will come shortly. I litterally havent been able to put this down. But enough of my impression on the book in all the chapters I've read, lets just talk about chapter one. When I first started reading I found myself in the same place as many of you. I thought the first little bit was very confusing, and really just started getting into the action very quickly. I agree with kari that the kids are very immature, and many of my questions are about that. I dont know why these kids took this disaster as a game. YOUR STUCK ON AN ISLAND! I think that their assumptions that they will be rescued and the way they are acting though is explained by their age. Of course we would not be doing what they are doing if we were in that situation. But over all my initial impression of LOF is very good.
I ,like many others, have a lot of questions so far. There are of course the ones that keep poping up like why are there only boys? and what island are they on? But alot of my questions, like jessica's, are what are the significance and symbolism of certain items, especially the shell. The shell is very powerful in these boys world now. It shows who is the leader, it brings them to a meeting, it shows who can speak. I think this power of the shell is going to end up in a bad way. Also, one of my main questions is who would be best to be their leader? In many ways i think Ralph is a good choice because he takes charge and the kids listen to him. However, I think Piggy is a good philosifer. He knows what they need to do and how they need to do it. But Piggy is shy and no one likes him or would even listen to him. Jack shows good leadership because he is leader of the chior boys. But in my personal opinion i think Jack is a phsyco and is going to snap. I dont know who would be the best leader, maybe a combination. Some other questions I have had are why don't the boys know eachother? Why are they all on the same plane if they don't know eachother? Why is there a variation in age? What exactly happened for them to crash. Where is the pilot? Are there people dead around the crash? Why arent they using supplies from the plane?
To answer other peoples questions I would be giving away parts to the book. And quite honestly, I have no idea the answer to some of the questions.
Here is a question I want to bring up. Do you think there is any connection between them calling Piggy "Piggy" and the fact that there are pigs on the island which they hunt? I think Jack has a crazy side and I think he is going to do something to Piggy. Im not saying he is going to kill him, but I think something is going to happen between Piggy and Jack. They obviously dont have a very good relationship with one another and I think this is a clue from the author that something is going to happen. What do you think?

Tue Sep 05, 09:26:00 PM  
Blogger BenH said...

A lot of people have been talking about all the unknowns, like why the boys dont know each other. I think these are very big questions, and I would love to know the answers to them. But it does not disterss me. Why? I stopped caring, and won't care until it becomes important. Right now it seems to be somewhat irrelevant, so I forgot it.

Tue Sep 05, 09:30:00 PM  
Blogger endsleye said...

So far I have really liked LOF! I like the description and detail the author uses about the island and the surroundings of the boys. It confuses me how Piggy and some of the other boys don't talk in complete sentences and use bad grammer. Also I'm confused on what they mean by the creepers. Is that all the plants growing around or like spider webs and such? Also by the scar do they mean where they crashed. But I am also unsure of what they crashed from, where they were headed, how come they don't know each other, and how come no adults survived or if they were even with adults. Other than all the perplexing and confusing matters, I really enjoy this book!

Tue Sep 05, 09:36:00 PM  
Blogger EmilyH said...

to respond to tyc, I'm guessing that the boys were on their way to some kind of boarding school, thats why in the very beginning they keep talking about their uniforms. There is a lot of discussion as far as piggy being smart or stupid and i think that he is a smart kid, but a freeloader, he tells everyone else what to do, and it usually is the smart thing to do, but he wont help anything get done. I think he is using his asthma as a crutch, maybe his asthma isnt really as bad as he plays it up to be and he is just lazy. I do think the boys should listen to him though. I do think that Ralph is a pretty good choice for a leader because although he is kind of mean to piggy he can take charge of the group and they respect him, a group that has a leader they like is more likely to listen to him even if he is stupid and have a semblance of order, rather than a group that has a smart leader that they don't like. I'm guessing that the "creepers" are the vines and undergrowth that usually inhabit a forest. Some people were asking about the 'scar' and although i'm not sure i think they are talking about the gash mae in the forest left by the plane crashing.
now for some questions of my own... The boys talk about the pilot dropping them and some stuff like that, does that mean he dropped them off or ejected them once the plane was hit? i suppose he must have ejected them because in the very beginning they are scattered all over tryin to find the others... Is the plane on the island? if so why aren't they using it for supplies they can use to build the shelters? they said something along the lines of "they're all gone" when talking about the people at the airport, does that mean the airport got attacked or the whole country, and if its the whole country could those boys be among the last people from their homeland? and finally i was wondering what's the deal with Jack? has he gone totally insane, that he would rather kill a pig than be rescued? i think he needs to get his priorities straight...

Tue Sep 05, 09:57:00 PM  
Blogger JoanneH said...

I have found Lord of the Flies to be an interesting read, but not the greatest I’ve ever read. It does show that, for all human technology, the primitive nature of humanity’s predecessors hides, bubbling under the surface, waiting to break free. This said nature can be a good thing, but it can also entail terrible results. This simple nature helps the boys to instinctively survive in their new domain. Discord, however will spread, as can be gathered from the arguments between the two leader figures in the community. As fractal geometry demonstrates, with each iteration, the problem grows bigger every time it is revisited, until the entire pattern in seeming chaos is found. By this point of discovery, the subject has reached and passed the point of no recovery.
I see this pattern in The Lord of the Flies. Slight confusion in the beginning leads to perfect harmony. There are more slight problems, but these are easily resolved. The fluctuations between harmony and discord seem chaotic, but are actually dictated by the society itself. The utopia is achieved at the point of perfect harmony, just before, as in fractal geometry, everything goes wrong. The society in Lord of the Flies will dissolve because it has by its behavior decided its own outcome. In choosing to become a utopia, it is taking the path towards dystopia.

*Please note that all references to chaos and fractal geometry come solely from Michael Crichton’s Jurassic Park, and any mistakes are my own.

Tue Sep 05, 10:28:00 PM  
Blogger connord said...

Through chapter one of Lord of the flies there was one thing that struck me in a huge way. To read how Piggy was picked on by Ralph really made me realize how mean kids can be. This carried on through the next couple chapters were piggy was prutally bullied. He is trying to be nice and reasonable, but he isnt taken seriously and he is just made fun of. Kids are still picked on like this today. After reading chapter one i wondered how the kids were going to get food and how they were going to work together when they are all pretty different and come from different backrounds.

Wed Sep 06, 06:25:00 PM  
Blogger alexm said...

Chapter 1 for me, was for the most part, confusing. I reread the chapter again, and now I have a basic understanding. I agree with connord in that Piggy is already being picked on by Ralph, and its sad. However, I think it's also funny the way he treats Piggy. I think Ralph respects piggy, but very much enjoys poking fun at him. The whole plot line is a little hazy still for me, but I hope to understand more over time.

Wed Sep 06, 08:24:00 PM  
Blogger tomr said...

I very much agree with karib in her comment about the boys being immature. Perhaps that is just to make the "survival story" aspect that much more challenging?

Wed Sep 06, 09:18:00 PM  
Blogger KathrynT said...

I noticed my error in speaking of the atom bomb. Yes, I did mean WWII not WWI. Sorry about any confusion.

Wed Sep 06, 11:46:00 PM  
Blogger KathrynT said...

Another question comes to mind as phillip said that they crashed on a tropical island. That is, what exactly is the weather like? We know that the island is humid and warm, but just how much so? Does it rain a lot there? What is it like at night? What sort of storm contributed to the crash? Knowing this information could help in finding out where it is that they are.

Wed Sep 06, 11:53:00 PM  
Blogger Mphair said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

Thu Sep 07, 12:55:00 PM  
Blogger HannahJ said...

Well when I started reading the book, I found it rather boring because nothing was going on yet. But now that I'm into he 3rd chapter and the characters have developed personalities, it's much more interesting to read.

Thu Sep 07, 06:32:00 PM  
Blogger lindseyc said...

My first impression of Lord of the Flies is that is very confusing. In the beginning, is doesn’t tell you that they were in a plane crash and landed on an island. You had to figure it out for yourself. I didn’t like this because when the author was explaining the setting or characters, I didn’t know whet was going on. I thought it was just like a normal day for these boys until I read the first few pages over again. But then, as the book progressed, I found myself getting bored because nothing was happening. It was just rambling on about these boys on an island. Because of this I had many questions. Who were these boys and why were there only boys on the plane? Where were the from? Where were they headed? What caused them to crash? None of these questions were even answered because the book was too busy explaining non-relevant details.

Sun Sep 10, 01:58:00 PM  
Blogger KathrynT said...

In the post about evil, I thought of a scary thought. We know about how Jack was very easily annoyed by Piggy and so unusually so. We also know how he is so anxious to kill a pig and how that seems to represent some evil. Well, what if Piggy pushed Jack's buttons a little too far? Could Piggy become the pig Jack is hunting for?

Sun Sep 10, 11:28:00 PM  
Blogger KO said...

I think everyone comments is right and the first chapter of the book was all right

Fri Sep 29, 12:04:00 PM  

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