Wednesday, October 11, 2006

Fahrenheit 451 Live Blogging 40-68 period 2

100 Comments:

Blogger Phillip said...

Let's get started!

Mon Oct 16, 08:44:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

i get second comment!

Mon Oct 16, 08:46:00 AM  
Blogger Kjerstinl said...

How come Mildred says that the TV walls are her family? Why isn't Montag good enough?

Mon Oct 16, 08:47:00 AM  
Blogger jbarry said...

this is a pretty cool book, not gonna lie

Mon Oct 16, 08:47:00 AM  
Blogger shaunam said...

I had the question of did Mildred really forget to tell Montag or did she just not want to tell him?

Mon Oct 16, 08:47:00 AM  
Blogger briang said...

First of all, could someone explain to me the whole tv wall thing. I dont really understand how they are her family, and i dont really understand the parlor. Help please

Mon Oct 16, 08:48:00 AM  
Blogger tanal said...

okay so i was kind of confused when mildred was talking to montag about the "relatives," at the beginning of this section. what are the relatives?

Mon Oct 16, 08:48:00 AM  
Blogger christas said...

Well, I was wondering what Montag's hands might symbolize, because he is always talking about how his hands act like they have a mind of their own and just took the book without him really thinking about it.

Mon Oct 16, 08:48:00 AM  
Blogger chelseah said...

Alee~ Listen to what they are saying right now, and Im sure some of your questions will be solved... also, just pay attention to what we are blogging right now, and by the end i think that it will help you.

Mon Oct 16, 08:48:00 AM  
Blogger Phillip said...

The seashell earpeice is a radio that you put in your ear like a earbuds minus the cords.

Mon Oct 16, 08:48:00 AM  
Blogger Kjerstinl said...

When Mildred and Montag were trying to figure out where they met, could it be possible that they were just made and put together? Like in the movie "The Island" They have some memories, but they were just created. Could this be like that?

Mon Oct 16, 08:48:00 AM  
Blogger endsleye said...

kjerstinl thats what I was thinking. Also doesn't it say that Mildred didn't know who was who in the T.V. walls?

Mon Oct 16, 08:49:00 AM  
Blogger Phillip said...

The family i think is a interactive soap opera, she gets to gossip and laugh with the "family" about the "family".

Mon Oct 16, 08:49:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

kjerstinl: i think that Mildred is acting like that because there is no such thing as a real family at that time. The TV gives life to everything...I think thats why she says it.

Mon Oct 16, 08:49:00 AM  
Blogger jbarry said...

The earpieces may represent the government speaking in your ear and being the only thing that goes into your head.

Mon Oct 16, 08:49:00 AM  
Blogger KathrynT said...

Kjerstinl-- I think that half the time Montag is gone, so she gets lonely and listtens to the tv walls. I am confused though how the tv walls work. Could someone help me here please?

Mon Oct 16, 08:50:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

I definately agree with Phillip...very good point

Mon Oct 16, 08:50:00 AM  
Blogger briang said...

I think Mildred really did forget, because she is not ver intelligent, and it seems like in this society, there isnt any feeling other than hppiness, or at least thats what they go for. I think death doesnt concern normal people. It was a bigger deal to Montag because he formed a bond with her.

Mon Oct 16, 08:50:00 AM  
Blogger Kjerstinl said...

If many of the ideas of the past have been lost, how come the idea of "family" is still around?

Mon Oct 16, 08:50:00 AM  
Blogger ETAC of LPS said...

why is burning a book such a big, deal? It's just paper, right?

Mon Oct 16, 08:50:00 AM  
Blogger chelseah said...

Jess~ I think that the old lady is having kind of the same affect on Montag as Clarisse did. They are both really starting to get to him, and make him question the life that he is living.

Mon Oct 16, 08:51:00 AM  
Blogger christas said...

tanal and briang~
The parlor is just where the people sit and watch TV. The TV takes up the whole wall. The relatives are the people in the shows that she watches on the TV. She is constantly involved in their "lives" and they are like her family because she constanly spends time with them in the living room.

Mon Oct 16, 08:52:00 AM  
Blogger jbarry said...

kjerstin yea that is a cool comment on the island because that is a lot like what i think is going on. this is an interesting book. I wonder what it is going to end up as

Mon Oct 16, 08:52:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

I play jokes on my TV obsessed friends by saying: "did you see that new episode of ______?" they insist on hearing what I was talking about, and when I tell them I wasn't actually talking about it, just making fun of them...they get mad because the TV is their savior

Mon Oct 16, 08:52:00 AM  
Blogger Connor DUCETIME said...

The walls are the things that the government can watch the people through i think. It is how they control and watch what the people are doin. For example, at the beginning of the novel it said that a married couple couldn't sleep together and I think that is monitered through the walls.

Mon Oct 16, 08:53:00 AM  
Blogger KathrynT said...

Thanks Adriana. I kind of picture them as the whole wall as a tv. Does anyone else see it this way?

Mon Oct 16, 08:53:00 AM  
Blogger Hannah J said...

yeah the parlor walls are just huge tvs that take up the whole wall. i couldn't imagine having a room with walls that are tvs. i think i'd get a headache.

Mon Oct 16, 08:53:00 AM  
Blogger tanal said...

I think that burning the books is such a big deal because everone thinks that the firemen used to put out fires rather than start them. Aslo they don't want the people to learn anything from reading the books. Also many things are made up in the books, so they dont want the people to gain any false information and ask any questions.

Mon Oct 16, 08:53:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

The TV has an enourmous part in what society is today. I don't think tha twill change for a good long time...

Mon Oct 16, 08:54:00 AM  
Blogger jbarry said...

When Bradbury wrote this book, tv was becoming a huge part of society. This was in the Vietnam era when reporters would come after battles and report to the rest of the nation exactly what was going on and depicting the graphic images of the war.

Mon Oct 16, 08:55:00 AM  
Blogger briang said...

TV does effect us. Now, you can thousands of channels that can give you any kind of information you want. The weather, the news, sports, history, science, cartoons, everything at some point or another can be found on tv it seems. T.V. is a huge part of our lives. We discuss it, we watch it, we learn from it.

Mon Oct 16, 08:55:00 AM  
Blogger Connor DUCETIME said...

I agree with alee. Books are symbolic for imagination and free thinking and the government doesn't want that.

Mon Oct 16, 08:55:00 AM  
Blogger christas said...

jessb~
I don't think that if technology keeps evolving we will be all trying to commit suicide and live in a dull colorless world like the people in F451,but I think that we may start to lose all human contact. For instance, you don't even have to go into banks anymore. You can just get your money in a little tube sent out of the bank. You don't have to go into restaurants- you can just go to the drive through. The only contact you get is when the McDonald's worker hands you your burger through the window.

Mon Oct 16, 08:55:00 AM  
Blogger tanal said...

Sara m you have a really good point. when bradbury wrote this book was he writing about now as the future since he wrote the book in 1950's?

Mon Oct 16, 08:56:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

Books allow us to think for ourselves, not a screen leaving no open ends. Think of all the really really good movies you've seen: almost all were books first...Silence of the Lambs, book. Lord of the Rings, book. Kinda weird isn't it...

Mon Oct 16, 08:56:00 AM  
Blogger jbarry said...

I think that Bradbury had a very bleak outlook at the future. He was warning us that technology would eventually take over our lives.

Mon Oct 16, 08:56:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

Bradbury has a creepy sense of what is to come inevitably in the future...

Mon Oct 16, 08:57:00 AM  
Blogger Connor DUCETIME said...

It is amazing that Bradbury could predict the importance of electronics way back in the fifties. Now everyone has a tv, a cell pone and an iPod. These things are integral to our society now.

Mon Oct 16, 08:57:00 AM  
Blogger christas said...

He does have a really bleak outlook on the future, but a lot of what he said is true today.

Mon Oct 16, 08:58:00 AM  
Blogger KathrynT said...

etac of lps: I think that that questioin is one that is a theme to all the people in the book except those people who have read them. It is possibly also important to the government. Montag becomes curious about them becuase he used to think that books were just something that they had to get rid of. Now that he has met Clarisse and has seen the woman who read them, he wonders what is so important about the books.

Mon Oct 16, 08:58:00 AM  
Blogger jbarry said...

Yea Alex, the basis of society up to the present day have been books. They have been the primary source of education for so long. Look at major religions. The koran, the bible, and other major religous beleifs are written in books.

Mon Oct 16, 08:59:00 AM  
Blogger jbarry said...

Bradbury was a pretty smart guy!

Mon Oct 16, 09:00:00 AM  
Blogger Phillip said...

I think clarisse's death was probably just more teen violence that she was talking about.

Mon Oct 16, 09:00:00 AM  
Blogger Connor DUCETIME said...

Adriana is right. Right now all the technology is a great thing for our society. Kids are learnihng more with laptops and technology such as the internet.

Mon Oct 16, 09:00:00 AM  
Blogger endsleye said...

Sarahc~Im not really sure about Clarisse's death because we don't really know the details about it. We only know that she is dead from Mildred.

Mon Oct 16, 09:00:00 AM  
Blogger shaunam said...

phillips~ why have teens become so violent?

Mon Oct 16, 09:01:00 AM  
Blogger jbarry said...

I think that there is a tangled gov plot behing the death of Clarrice

Mon Oct 16, 09:01:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

When one thinks about it, technology as actually given people more excuses as to why they haven't come up to standards. Oh my computer crashed...my printer was broken...inernet failure. Back then, there was less work to do, so there was less stress. Wit computers you can multitask very easy, increasing work load...I HATE IT

Mon Oct 16, 09:01:00 AM  
Blogger tanal said...

We don't knkow for sure yet if Clarrise is dead right? I mean everyone thinks she ws hit by a car and killed because no one has seen her ar her family, but do we know for sure if she is dead?

Mon Oct 16, 09:01:00 AM  
Blogger christas said...

kimmyc~
Cowardice is so common in this society because the people are just plain scared of getting caught doing something "wrong" and having their houses burned down. They just kinda want to be left alone and not have to think about anything besides the shallow life of the "relatives".

Mon Oct 16, 09:01:00 AM  
Blogger Connor DUCETIME said...

I have no idea what happened to cause clarrise's death, but knowing ow this society works she could have been murdered for a purpose.

Mon Oct 16, 09:01:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

Im with Josh on Clarisses death...I don't think that it was mere coincidence

Mon Oct 16, 09:02:00 AM  
Blogger shaunam said...

I agree with adrianag and connord because yes, technology could take over us, but that is only if we let it. We can use it in a good way, or a bad way. Plus,

Mon Oct 16, 09:02:00 AM  
Blogger ETAC of LPS said...

How does fear play a role in the passage of unjust laws?

Mon Oct 16, 09:02:00 AM  
Blogger Connor DUCETIME said...

Clarrise is very important because she made Montag "see the light". She made him understand how wrong the society is and how he is unhappy.

Mon Oct 16, 09:03:00 AM  
Blogger Hannah J said...

i find it interesting that this book is banned and it's about banning books. it's kind of a hard concept to think about.

Mon Oct 16, 09:03:00 AM  
Blogger christas said...

Good point, aleea. Maybe the government had heard about Clarisse and her abnormal way of thinking and observing things and just wanted to get rid of her. Maybe her getting hit by a car wasn't an accident.

Mon Oct 16, 09:03:00 AM  
Blogger Phillip said...

I don't books are less inferior, maybe textbooks, but actual fiction books aren't online, Barnes and noble is a huge chain and they're main thing is books.

Mon Oct 16, 09:03:00 AM  
Blogger KathrynT said...

To saram about the tvs and the books-- I think that maybe not all the people have the tv walls. The people have to pay for them. Maybe the people who have books don't have tvs.

Mon Oct 16, 09:03:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

Clarisse is the catalyst that starts everything off...I think Bradbury did the right thing.

Mon Oct 16, 09:04:00 AM  
Blogger endsleye said...

Shaun,
Im not sure why the teens are so violent. Is it because they don't really learn anything. They go to school to watch t.v. and everything. And since t.v. is such a huge a part of their life. So it enfluences them.

Mon Oct 16, 09:04:00 AM  
Blogger shaunam said...

etac of lps~ people make unjust laws because they think that if there is something out there that may not satisfy other people, then there must be a law banning it so that no one can think for themselves, and so that everyone can be "protected."

Mon Oct 16, 09:05:00 AM  
Blogger ETAC of LPS said...

Does liberty Conflict with security?

Mon Oct 16, 09:06:00 AM  
Blogger Phillip said...

I think the people have books are all getting old, like in 1984, the people who remeber before the revolution are all dead or dying. So i think all the people who have books are all old and the new generation doesn't have books.

Mon Oct 16, 09:06:00 AM  
Blogger shaunam said...

Ends~ I see what you are saying, there was a piece on the news about kids who watched that intense cage wrestleing and then they went out to a park and did it and ended up killing eachother. Is this what it has come to?

Mon Oct 16, 09:07:00 AM  
Blogger endsleye said...

etac of lps,
I think that people make unjust laws because they are afraid of what would happen if there was too much freedom. I think the govt. is afraid if people were able to think more for themselves and have more power.

Mon Oct 16, 09:07:00 AM  
Blogger christas said...

sarahc~
Maybe Beatty knows how Montag is feeling because he felt the same way once. maybe he once wondered what was in books and maybe read a few.

Mon Oct 16, 09:07:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

ETAC OF LPS: Libery and security are contradictory words...they don't even belong in the same sentence...

Mon Oct 16, 09:08:00 AM  
Blogger shaunam said...

To the inside circle, if we are banning things to protect children, then what are the kids going to do when they grow up and they are all on their own?

Mon Oct 16, 09:08:00 AM  
Blogger endsleye said...

Shaun~ I agree with you because with t.v. and video games and everything else out there, the things that they show are COOL. well the kids at least think they are cool! and then they are like oh if so and so can do this then I can do it too!

Mon Oct 16, 09:10:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

My bad...liberty is spelled l-i-b-e-r-t-y

Mon Oct 16, 09:10:00 AM  
Blogger KathrynT said...

Here is a connection between the book and our fishbowl: the technology s taking over the people and we don't want that to happen. the techonolgy is a tool for us and we can't rely on it. The ability to talk face to face as in a normal discussion is still important. The people in F451 don't interact much with each other and rely on the technology, which is not always reliable.

Mon Oct 16, 09:10:00 AM  
Blogger christas said...

To the people who are talking about the government making unjust laws, I think that maybe they are just trying to protect us, but they just don't know the whole story. They might think that on blogs we will put our personal info in it and be suseptible to online predators. What they don't know is how blogs benefit us in the classroom, so they make laws to protect us, but they really might be taking away something very valuable.

Mon Oct 16, 09:10:00 AM  
Blogger briang said...

Thats weird that it would be banned for swearing. That means that other books would be banned souly for swearing. This is how they censor books, like they do TV and music, they just put it on the banned list, so that they dont have to tear apart the content.

Mon Oct 16, 09:10:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

In response to Shauna- We won't be able to think anything... What a concept eh?

Mon Oct 16, 09:11:00 AM  
Blogger tanal said...

I think that liberty can conflict with security, because if everyone has all of the freedom then maybe the country wouldn't be as secure. also it is harder to secure everyone and the area if everyone has ewual privledges and freedom. You can't control everyone and people have an option to challenge the system or get their own power.

Mon Oct 16, 09:11:00 AM  
Blogger shaunam said...

etac of lps~ I agree with alexm, that those words do not even belong in the same sentence. People are in control of what they blog. It is just a matter of if or when they will lose control.

Mon Oct 16, 09:11:00 AM  
Blogger shaunam said...

aleea~ I agree with that except for the fact that maybe that "transition" period would be the strangest.

Mon Oct 16, 09:13:00 AM  
Blogger christas said...

I agree, sara m.

Mon Oct 16, 09:14:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

Jess- I could ban a book because it conflicts to my beliefs...It wouldnt become famous, but it would still be banned. I could ben Johnny Tremain fro being such a god awful book. Forbes tries hard to make it horrible

Mon Oct 16, 09:14:00 AM  
Blogger tanal said...

I don't think that the people in f451 even know what love actually is.

Mon Oct 16, 09:16:00 AM  
Blogger ETAC of LPS said...

jess
100% Liberty is chaos. But 100% Security is prison. SInce we want appropriate measures of BOTH, we must have a process to debate the balance so that the interests of the people and the person are both served.

So, I think we should debate these proposed laws, consider safety for children, but don't trample upon the First Amendment unecessarily.

-Dan Maas

Mon Oct 16, 09:17:00 AM  
Blogger christas said...

kimmyc~
I agree. There is not as much an emphasis on family. Mildred never even wanted children. She is so wrapped up in the lives of her "relatives" that she doesn't even want to deal with having a real family.

Mon Oct 16, 09:17:00 AM  
Blogger Phillip said...

Mildred just thinks that their marriage is normal, that everyone doesn't care about their spouse all that much. That they just live together and see eachother before and after work.

Mon Oct 16, 09:17:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

Tana- I think you are right... Its like in the Giver when Jonas asks his "parents" if they love him. They tell him that there is no such thing as love anymore

Mon Oct 16, 09:17:00 AM  
Blogger shaunam said...

elyseh~ I know! People usually remember that for the rest of their lives. Personally, they seem more like brother and sister rather than marriage because Mildred is more into the parlor and the TV than anything else.

Mon Oct 16, 09:18:00 AM  
Blogger Phillip said...

elyse~ she probably doesn't tell because she was scared of being burned also.

Mon Oct 16, 09:18:00 AM  
Blogger endsleye said...

Elyse. I agree with you. It was only 10 years ago and they can't remember. My parents have been married for 20 years and could probably tell me every second on the first day they met. And we have computers and cell phones and everything else. They only have the T.V. walls and the ear pieces.

Mon Oct 16, 09:18:00 AM  
Blogger briang said...

elyse, i dont think she would tell on him because if she did, she would be in as deep as he is because they were in their house. Mildred wouldnt tell so she could protect herself i think.

Mon Oct 16, 09:20:00 AM  
Blogger christas said...

I think that Mildred and Montag seem more like complete strangers. They know barely know or remember anything about each other and they don't have any real love for one another.

Mon Oct 16, 09:20:00 AM  
Blogger Alex_Manning said...

etac of LPS-
you are right... if we called them somthing else it might be better. The term 'liberty' has become to subject to conflict, and its been worn out. If we call it something else it might be better.

Mon Oct 16, 09:20:00 AM  
Blogger KathrynT said...

alexm-- not anyone can ban a book. I think that you could challenge them though. go to the ala website on challenging books: http://www.ala.org/ala/oif/challengesupport/challengesupport.htm

Mon Oct 16, 09:21:00 AM  
Blogger ETAC of LPS said...

alexm
Can you explain how a concept like liberty is worn out, as you've indicated? What does the word mean to you? What images does this word create for you?

-Dan Maas

Mon Oct 16, 09:22:00 AM  
Blogger ETAC of LPS said...

Test

Mon Oct 16, 09:31:00 AM  
Blogger ETAC of LPS said...

Testing again

Mon Oct 16, 12:17:00 PM  
Blogger chelseah said...

I just have one question that i have been wondering about... Are the parlor walls virtual or real? Can Mildred interact with them, or are they just like watching a TV? Do the people like come out of the walls, and interact with them, or how do they work??

Mon Oct 16, 04:55:00 PM  
Blogger KathrynT said...

etac of lps, To give my veiw on your question for alexm on 'liberty' being wor out, I think that nowadays people don't really understand exactly what it means. It is something that we take for granted in the United States. Many interpret it to mean/ include freedom and was something that our country was founded on. But what is it exactly? I think that that is how it has been 'worn out.' We think of it so often as just freedom or something of the like. Its just something we take for granted in America and we are not even sure of what its full definition. I will try to find that definition and will post it.

Mon Oct 16, 08:38:00 PM  
Blogger KathrynT said...

Definitions of liberty on the Web:

autonomy: immunity from arbitrary exercise of authority: political independence
freedom of choice; "liberty of opinion"; "liberty of worship"; "liberty--perfect liberty--to think or feel or do just as one pleases"; "at liberty to choose whatever occupation one wishes"
personal freedom from servitude or confinement or oppression
shore leave: leave granted to a sailor or naval officer
familiarity: an act of undue intimacy
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

Thanks to google! (Search)" define: liberty "

Mon Oct 16, 09:09:00 PM  
Blogger KathrynT said...

Here's a thought I had: It is ironic that we are reading a book about burning books and how technology is taking over society. We keep thinking that this is bad and that they shouldn't burn the books. But then we have the discussion going on about the Laptops and how we won't need paper and how technology is better. Is technology really better? we now use the laptops more and no longer use much paper at all in class and at the same time are reading and disscussing about how books -- paper-- shouldn't be gotton rid of. What do you think? Does anyone else agree with me on how ironic this is?

Sun Oct 22, 08:26:00 PM  
Blogger Someonewhocares said...

This book whould be burnt! Montag wants to get laid by Clarisse and shes only 17!

Wed Mar 19, 10:19:00 PM  

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